PMC Usability Meeting 20100312
Date: 2010-03-12
Time: 2PM GMT
Venue: irc #adempiere-team
Support Spreadsheet: Adempiere PMC Usability
Chat times in GMT-5
(09:00:02) CarlosRuiz: Hi
(09:00:13) kai7: Hi Carlos
(09:02:04) CarlosRuiz: do you want to propose an agenda for today?
(09:02:04) CarlosRuiz: I would like just to prioritize our current wishlist - and maybe think on redaction of forum thread for community brainstorm
(09:02:46) kai7: Yes, that's sounds good.
(09:02:58) kai7: Since I didn't do anything the last weeks...
(09:03:01) kai7: Sorry for this.
(09:03:54) kai7: But we have release date for the Front Panel Designer 4.0: 1st of april
(09:04:00) CarlosRuiz: no problem - this is not an urgent topic - it's important but not urgent - so it's in the second quadrant of seven habits :-)
(09:04:16) kai7: :-)
(09:05:05) kai7: OK, let's start with the wish list
(09:06:07) CarlosRuiz: although we have an incomplete list not validated with community :-)
(09:06:07) CarlosRuiz: we have 22 items there
(09:06:41) CarlosRuiz: maybe we simply look the list and mark those "highly desirable" ?
(09:07:57) kai7: Let me go thru it again...
(09:09:35) kai7: #12 is already done by metas (at least the color) :-)
(09:10:35) kai7: Maybe a small interlude:
(09:10:56) kai7: I had a interesting discussion on the CeBIT (I had an presentation about ADempiere there)
(09:11:19) kai7: And there had been some ppl not very happy with the usablilty of AD
(09:11:28) kai7: (they liked the functionality)
(09:11:51) kai7: On thing they tried is to model their business workflows with the workflow editor
(09:12:10) kai7: But they hadn't been very successful...
(09:12:34) kai7: I guess the editor is promising something it couldn't keep. ;-)
(09:12:56) kai7: The question is:
(09:13:03) kai7: Could we make a wish out of it?
(09:13:05) kai7: Or:
(09:13:16) kai7: What could you expect from such an editor?
(09:13:23) kai7: Is it an realistic aim?
(09:13:41) CarlosRuiz: added wishlist 23 - that sound ok-
(09:13:42) CarlosRuiz: _
(09:13:44) CarlosRuiz: ?
(09:14:13) kai7: Sounds good for the first improvements
(09:14:25) CarlosRuiz: The other potential WISIWYG editor is for print formats
(09:14:28) kai7: And later we could figure out if we could go further
(09:14:31) kai7: Yes
(09:14:41) kai7: What print formats do you mean?
(09:14:45) kai7: Jasper?
(09:14:51) CarlosRuiz: nope - adempiere print formats
(09:14:54) kai7: It's #7
(09:15:03) CarlosRuiz: jasper has already a WISIWYG editor - is ireport
(09:15:11) kai7: Maybe we should imporve the print formats first. :-)
(09:15:35) kai7: Yes, but it's not really a good tool for end user.
(09:16:02) CarlosRuiz: no, for end user I like the reporting engine by JJ
(09:16:24) CarlosRuiz: but an end user doesn't know how to fill all those fields in print format
(09:16:34) kai7: Yes, if we improve it and add an editor it could be relly nice.
(09:18:30) CarlosRuiz: for me the most desirable at this moment would be:
(09:18:57) CarlosRuiz: 17, 18, 20, 21, 22
(09:19:19) CarlosRuiz: adding comments about
(09:19:36) kai7: BTW: question to #20: What should be in this table?
(09:20:25) kai7: I guess the question for the most desirable points could be very different for different people.
(09:20:40) kai7: Should start a survey on it?
(09:20:52) CarlosRuiz: yep - and I guess I have in my mind what are most easily workable :-) biased
(09:21:13) CarlosRuiz: the user preference table is not a usability improvement per se
(09:21:13) CarlosRuiz: but it enables lots of them
(09:21:15) CarlosRuiz: for example
(09:21:34) CarlosRuiz: a user preference for "don't ask me again" in warning windows
(09:21:45) CarlosRuiz: or a user preference to save layout of window - grid mode, etc
(09:22:29) CarlosRuiz: Indeed we could migrate the current Tools -> Preference window there
(09:22:43) kai7: OK, I see.
(09:22:54) CarlosRuiz: Adding a preference to Tools -> Preference is hard - so most developers think twice before adding a preference
(09:23:03) CarlosRuiz: and webui has not implemented that yet
(09:23:10) CarlosRuiz: so a user preference window can join that
(09:23:34) kai7: OK, I see
(09:24:34) kai7: I guess the list is not so bad.
(09:24:38) CarlosRuiz: I'll add another one that was contributed by e-evolution but it was reverted ...
(09:25:29) kai7: Should we go to the forums with this list and ask the people first for suggestion for additional points?
(09:25:39) kai7: And then make a survey for the priorities?
(09:26:29) CarlosRuiz: sure, that can give us an idea about what people have in mind to improve usability
(09:26:31) CarlosRuiz: or
(09:26:48) CarlosRuiz: we could put these ideas in ideatorrent
(09:26:57) CarlosRuiz: and let the community vote for their preferred
(09:27:32) CarlosRuiz: have you seen ideatorrent?
(09:27:36) CarlosRuiz: it's enabled for adempiere
(09:28:26) CarlosRuiz: here
(09:28:26) CarlosRuiz: https://sourceforge.net/apps/ideatorrent/adempiere/
(09:28:38) kai7: Yes, I had a small look to it.
(09:29:00) kai7: So it could create such surverys?
(09:29:21) CarlosRuiz: not a survey - more like a voting per case
(09:29:57) CarlosRuiz: for example
(09:29:57) CarlosRuiz: I added this idea in sourceforge project
(09:29:57) CarlosRuiz: http://sourceforge.net/apps/ideatorrent/sourceforge/ideatorrent/idea/591/
(09:29:57) CarlosRuiz: you can go there and vote positively or negatively or add your comments or proposed solutions
(09:31:15) kai7: But shouldn't it be more a vote, that could give us a ranking?
(09:31:37) kai7: So I would thing of a list, where everyone could pick 3-4 items
(09:31:38) CarlosRuiz: sorry - didn't understand the question
(09:32:05) CarlosRuiz: ah, no, people could vote for the 24
(09:32:27) kai7: I guess Limesurvey could handel this.
(09:32:54) kai7: (or 30 if you add the other ideas we get :-) )
(09:33:35) CarlosRuiz: but that's ok - if people like the 30 :-)
(09:33:48) kai7: Yes, but I want a priority list
(09:34:02) kai7: I guess there is no idea we shouldn't do.
(09:34:04) CarlosRuiz: hopefully people will add lots of ideas
(09:34:12) CarlosRuiz: and other people will vote for them
(09:34:18) kai7: (BTW: I added a comment for # 16)
(09:34:43) kai7: It's more a question what to do first.
(09:36:05) CarlosRuiz: yep - I would prefer to go straight to the ideatorrent tool
(09:36:05) CarlosRuiz: but you decide :-) you're usability leader
(09:36:34) kai7: OK, I guess we could start with the brainstorm step
(09:36:46) kai7: and decide regarding the voting tool later
(09:37:27) CarlosRuiz: another task could be to review feature requests and bugs to check for usability related
(09:37:55) CarlosRuiz: as I'm working on triage I can do that
(09:38:06) CarlosRuiz: added as task #7
(09:38:06) kai7: Great :-)
(09:38:34) kai7: OK, I could do the forum post on weekend
(09:39:16) CarlosRuiz: ready / changed expected date on task
(09:39:28) kai7: OK
(09:39:57) CarlosRuiz: if you decide for ideatorrent I can open the ideas there - with LimeSurvey I don't have experience (but I can learn)
(09:40:21) trifon: LimeServer is to count Votes
(09:40:33) trifon: Idea torrent allows users to add thier ideas too, i think.
(09:40:51) kai7: OK, I will have a deeper look to ideatorrent
(09:41:07) trifon: as idea collecter i think better option is idea torrent
(09:41:21) kai7: LimeSurvey could create quit complex surveys, but you are right: It's eventually for counting votes.
(09:41:40) kai7: Yes
(09:41:50) kai7: So we could offer it, to enter them
(09:41:52) CarlosRuiz: hmmm
(09:42:12) kai7: Or OK, maybe we just start with the forum. :-)
(09:42:23) CarlosRuiz: yep - KISS principle
(09:42:27) CarlosRuiz: for start
(09:42:34) kai7: OK
(09:42:55) CarlosRuiz: you can put the list in forums and ask for "vote your top 5 favorites" or something like that
(09:42:55) CarlosRuiz: and "add your usability idea here" we'll collect them
(09:43:13) kai7: OK
(09:43:23) kai7: Could we open the wishlist for the public?
(09:43:29) kai7: Or should I post it?
(09:43:53) CarlosRuiz: it's public read-only
(09:44:17) kai7: Good, then I could post the link: https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AhBAFce33rWhdFEya2I2enRpendaUW1JcnhGT1RxVUE&hl=es&pli=1
(09:44:21) kai7: ?
(09:44:30) CarlosRuiz: nope
(09:44:49) CarlosRuiz: this is the public link for read-only access
(09:44:49) CarlosRuiz: http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tQ2kb6ztizwZQmIrxFOTqUA&gid=1
(09:45:38) kai7: Ah, OK I will use this one. :-)
(09:46:25) kai7: Hm, it seems I have to learn spanish. :-)
(09:47:04) CarlosRuiz: let me check ...
(09:47:31) CarlosRuiz: ready - this is the link in english
(09:47:31) CarlosRuiz: http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tQ2kb6ztizwZQmIrxFOTqUA&gid=1&hl=en
(09:47:55) trifon: why i can't vote twice in IdeaTorrent :(
(09:48:02) trifon: voted once for the karma...
(09:50:55) CarlosRuiz: ok kai7, I guess we can finish this meeting, right?
(09:51:04) kai7: Yes, I guess so.
(09:51:20) kai7: So thank you.
(09:51:50) CarlosRuiz: thanks kai7 and trifon for attending the meeting - good outcome
